Elaine shares her incredible journey of reversing symptoms and coming off medication entirely. Her story is a testament to the power of lifestyle changes in overcoming RA.

We discuss in this interview:

• Elaine’s journey of reversing rheumatoid arthritis symptoms without medication after years of discipline and effort.
• The initial challenges she faced while adapting to a new diet and lifestyle.
• Achieving remission under the supportive guidance of her rheumatologist.
• Decisions to taper off prescription drugs with a focus on natural health improvement.
• The impact of dietary changes on her energy and overall wellness.
• Overcoming weather sensitivity and diminishing her RA symptoms.
• The pivotal role of consistent and increasing physical activity in her recovery.
• Elaine’s proactive management of her condition and lifestyle to maintain remission.
• Strategies for maintaining health and avoiding RA symptom recurrence.
• Her future plans to embrace active adventures and continue enjoying life to the fullest.

Clint – If you have rheumatoid arthritis and you want another story of someone who’s been able to reverse their symptoms and come off their drugs, then you’re in the right place. That’s what we’re going to talk about today with Elaine. So Elaine has been able to achieve tremendous things with her RA, and has recently been told that she can now completely discontinue her medication because of all the hard work and discipline that she’s put in place over the past year or two. So, Elaine, welcome to the podcast. Your second appearance last time you’d made a lot of improvements. This time you’ve literally slam dunk everything. So welcome, Elaine.

Elaine – Thanks, Clint. It is really a pleasure to be here again.

Clint – All right. Now let’s talk about just do a sort of a success stack here for myself and our listeners. Just list some of the things you’ve been able to achieve with your rheumatoid arthritis.

Elaine – Oh boy. There are just so many successes, so many wins. The first one that really comes to mind was that before I started this program, I had some residual swelling. And when I started the program, it disappeared. I mean, that to me was the signal that. Okay, I’m headed in the right direction here. So that was exciting. Just being able to gradually start tapering off the medication every time I did it, which was three times. It all felt like a win. You know, waking up in the morning and not feeling stiff and sore and achy and having more energy, you know, just being able to exercise and get out and not have to really think about any limitations. I’ve regained my life.

Clint – You were weather-sensitive as well. And that’s reduced.

Elaine – I was weather-sensitive. Absolutely. Any changes in barometric pressure, I would feel it coming on, and I don’t notice that anymore. Like I say, I mean, I really find myself realizing that I’m not thinking about symptoms anymore. So whether or not the weather is good or bad, it makes no difference to me because I feel the same pretty much every single day.

Clint – Did you ever think that you’d get to the point where you were symptom free without drugs?

Elaine – I had hoped, you know, I held out hope that it was a possibility, but I was prepared that that might not happen. Um, so, yeah, I mean, this is just such a blessing for me and just so grateful and happy to be in this situation. And it was a goal that I had. You know, I remember discussing it with you in our very, very first call back in, gosh, I guess it was May of 2024, which was about six months after I’d started working on the program, just on my own. But when I started working with you and doing the coaching sessions and everything, that was my goal, you know, and I would have been happy even just tapering it off, because less medication is always a good thing. But to be able to say that I was on no medication, really, um, that was the ultimate for me.

Clint – And your rheumatologist has been overseeing this entire process. So tell me the conversation most recently that you had with your rheumatologist about the medications.

Elaine – Um, so, yeah. So, um, she’s been very supportive. She knew that I didn’t want to be on medication. Um, and was very supportive of the, the changes that I was making and and helped me with tapering everything off. And not this last time, but the time before she had said, you know, just be cautious with tapering it off because I’ve seen where if you go too quickly, you can have a setback and it’s harder to get back to where you were previously when you’ve had that kind of a setback. So I thought, okay, I’m taking that guidance and so tapered a little bit more. And then when I went in this last visit, which was this past November, um, she basically the first thing she said when she walked into the room was, gee, you look great. I thought, okay, that’s good to hear. That’s good news. And she, um, you know, looked me over and checked all of my joints and my movement and everything. And she said, well, I don’t know what happened to you, and I’m not sure whether she meant, you know, what happened to you now or what happened to me when it was the onset of it, she said. It looks like you’ve gone into remission, which was exciting to hear. So, you know, we talked a bit about the medication and I wanted to wait until my next blood test, which was another three months. Um, so just very recently, last week, I had it, um, just to make sure that I was stable at, um, the last reduction. And she said, you know, I think that you could probably go off it at that point. And she said, to be honest with you, I think you could actually go off it now, which was three months ago. And I thought, you know, I’ve come this far. I don’t want to push it for the sake of three months. I’ll just continue with the reduced amount and see how my blood work is. And it came back virtually as good as three months ago. So that was when I said, okay, no more medication.

Clint – What was the criteria for the rheumatologist to continue to make these tapers? Was it symptom investigation in the clinic with the additional evidence of blood tests? Also patient feedback i.e. what you thought about it. What was that sort of collaboration and what was the criteria?

Elaine – Um, I would say probably yes to all of that. Um, you know how I have been feeling, um, first and foremost, the blood work and the, the CRP level, which has been low for quite some time now, even with the reductions and just how I was looking, how I was moving, how I was, how my joints look. Um, yeah. And just sort of the anecdotal day to day, how my body was responding to the changes.

Clint – Now we’re talking about hydroxychloroquine here. We’re talking about plaquenil. Initially, this same rheumatologist had wanted you not to reduce but to actually add another medication. What was that discussion about initially?

Elaine – I had been on the hydroxychloroquine since, uh, April. No, actually, since June of 2022. And when we had discussed adding the methotrexate was probably in the fall of 2023, like, I’m going to say probably around October of 2023. And it was because the that particular hydroxychloroquine had taken me as far as it could go. And I still had stiffness in my hands. My toes were still swollen, you know. I still had some joint pain, and I felt as though I wasn’t where I needed to be. And so that’s when she suggested layering on. So not switching one for the other, but adding another medication into the mix. And it meant weekly injections and monthly blood tests. And I thought, no, that’s not the way I want my life to be. And so that’s when I started to explore lifestyle alternatives and found your program.

Clint – Do you think that it was more a desire to avoid drug escalations, or more of a desire to reach certain levels of health and lifestyle achievements? That was your biggest driver?

Elaine – I guess to me they kind of go hand in hand because. Medications can affect you in other ways. Yes, they can reduce the RA symptoms, but what are they doing? You know there’s always the list of may cause certain side effects and nausea and what have you. And so to be feeling optimal to me meant being symptom free and off medication, which isn’t always possible. I understand that, but that was sort of my goal. So it to me, they went hand in hand, if that makes sense.

Clint – Yeah. And of all of the things that you’ve done since you got started with us, what do you think would be 1 or 2 of the most satisfying achievements? Not with the drug reduction, but with the lifestyle changes that you’ve made?

Elaine – Definitely, as far as the diet is concerned, because that’s what I focused on to begin with. So, you know, it obviously was a bit challenging to get used to changing my eating habits and everything, but intuitively they made sense to me. They all sounded extremely healthy. And so I really went for it. And I noticed an immediate improvement and had more energy. You know, I just felt so much better. Nothing else had changed. The medication was still exactly the way it was prior to joining the program. So it was really changing my diet vastly improved my energy levels and um, probably mental outlook to some degree as well because I was feeling better. Right. Um, and because I had more energy working out became easier. It wasn’t a struggle for me. So they kind of went hand in hand, but it was almost like a step kind of process where the better I felt, the more energy I had because of the improved diet meant that I had more energy to put into doing the exercise, which is the other half of this equation, as we know. Um, and yeah, you know, it kind of would I’d feel better. I’d be able to work out more, I’d work out more, I’d feel better. And so I just kept going up, you know, as far as energy and activity levels and everything else.

Clint – Yeah. If you’re listening to this and not watching this on YouTube, Elaine just used like, almost a, like a set of stairs that you would, uh, see in a house. Um, with her hand to show that when being able to eat more diversity, have less pain, and then able to exercise more. Up another step and then another step. And it just continues to create this positive momentum. Um, what were the most difficult parts of all the lifestyle changes for you?

Elaine – Probably just I mean, basically my husband and I eat two different things three times a day, you know? So it wasn’t just a change for me. It was a change for him, because now we’re somewhat independent in terms of what we’re having for breakfast, lunch and dinner. So that was kind of something to get used to. Um, and probably finding the time to make sure that it was all happening when it’s supposed to be happening, you know, making sure that I was fitting my workouts in because earlier on I was still busy with work. And so I just I had to alter my routine to make sure that I faithfully had my workout in every single day before any other distractions happened. So it was an adjustment. It wasn’t like it was a huge hardship. It was just some changes that we as a couple had to get used to. But you know, when we both saw the results, you know, because he was living with it as much as I was and seeing what it was doing to me and how it was affecting me and that affects him. Um, you know, we realized that it was worth it.

Clint – The areas that were affected in the past, how are all of those now? Like, if you could recall for me, going back a couple of years, where the areas that were most impacted by RA and list them and then describe how they are now.

Elaine – It’s probably easier to list the ones that weren’t affected, to be honest with you. Um. Gosh. I mean, hands, feet, ankles, wrists, elbows, shoulders, hips. Not so much in my back or neck, but, you know, definitely shoulders rotator those areas. And it wasn’t just the joints, it was the tendons and muscles and everything. I was pretty achy and swollen all over. You know, when it first hit me, I was swollen really quite badly through, you know, particularly knees, feet, ankles, hands, wrists, all of that. And there are now 100% back there. They’re probably even better than they were before, given how low my inflammation rate is. You know, I have really no swelling, no tenderness in joints or tendons or anything like that.

Clint – What does your rheumatologist say when she meets with you now and looks at your labs and looks at your hands and wrists and shoulders. And what? How would you describe what you think she’s thinking and feeling about your situation?

Elaine – This is a tough one for me. Um. We don’t spend a lot of time together. You know, I meet with her every six months, and we spend maybe 10, 15, 20 minutes at the most, at which time she’s asking me questions and checking me out and everything. But she hasn’t really. I’ve described to her what changes I’ve made. And she said, oh that’s great. And you know that that’s kind of been it. Not that she has not asked me any questions about what I’m doing. It’s me proactively saying, here’s what I’ve done. I’ve changed my eating habits. I’m working out. And she says, oh, that’s that’s great. I’m very supportive of a whole food plant based diet and exercise is great and all of that. So she’s very supportive of it, as is my GP. Um, so that’s not an issue. But I haven’t seen an aha that says you’ve changed your lifestyle. This is the impact that it’s having. We haven’t had that kind of discussion. It’s just acknowledging, okay, this is what you’ve done. Um, I guess it’s kind of hard for me to describe, but, I’m not sure what else to say in that regard.

Clint – It’s tricky, isn’t it?

Elaine – It is tricky. She’s been very supportive of it and very supportive of me reducing the medication, and she knew that that was my goal. And but there hasn’t been oh gee, I can see that that lifestyle change has really impacted your RA outcomes. I mean that that has not been a discussion. It’s just you’re looking great. And I guess in her mind, she’s probably saying, well, whatever you’re doing, it’s working for you, and just hasn’t articulated that. Um, you know, I appreciate that. She’s busy and she’s focused and she has her process that she goes through when she meets with me. But there hasn’t been any great discussion about what I have been doing other than me proactively offering up, hey, here’s what I’m doing.

Clint – Now I think all of us feel that there is a lack of openness to adjusting the approach that’s being used, and a lack of seeking to do more of what works. Because in our business, as you know, like we encourage everyone to do more of what works. If you find that moving your elbows a lot throughout the day helps to reduce symptoms, then don’t do it 100 times. Do it 2000 times. You know the joints meant to be moved. If we find that as we’re getting stronger, we feel better, then don’t stop it twice a week. Let’s do it every day at a level that isn’t maybe as intense so that we have that recovery adequate in just 24 hours. And we can keep doing that strength building. And this applies across the board with every lifestyle change, do more of what works. So if I were to be overseeing someone’s health in a medical professional way, and I saw an outlier who told me all the things that they were doing, and they got results that were wildly different to the other 999 people in my clinic. Then I’d be fascinated about that outlier and want to recommend, or at least check the research that exists, so that I felt comfortable to recommend all of the things that the outlier was doing. And I think this is why we always feel a little bit bewildered as to why that doesn’t happen, because this isn’t the first story we’ve shared on this channel. This is the hundreds upon hundreds of story we’ve shared on this channel. And the rheumatologist, for the most part, not mine, but for the most part, just say, keep doing what you’re doing and we’ll see you again in a period of time without that level of intent to actually go and educate themselves on what works in the lifestyle angle.

Elaine – And I find that frustrating and sad, you know, because it could be perhaps helping other people in that practice. But, you know, we do what we can do, but, uh, I’m happy it’s working for me. Um, just one thing. You know, you talk about how if something is working for you within reason, do more of it. And that’s one thing as far as the physical activity that I’ve really noticed, because, you know, I think once you’ve implemented the diet changes and that’s holding steady that, you know, you just keep on keeping on with the food and that’s great. But where you can really, I think, exponentially make a difference is with the physical activity and even recently. So it took me three times. So I started reducing the medication. First I cut it in half, then I reduced it to every third day. And then most recently I reduced it to twice a week. You know, just a slight reduction from the previous one. And but what I did this last time because I had more energy, I thought, and I do strength training three days a week and I do stretching and mobility and and walking every day. And I had introduced cardio and I was doing 15 minutes twice a week. And I thought, you know, I’ve got more energy to give here and I’m going to try increasing the duration of it.

Elaine – So I started doing half-hour sessions twice a week and thought, no, I can keep I can do more than this. And even though I didn’t reduce my medication, I was feeling better. And so I thought, okay, I’m going to keep going on this. So now I’m up to doing a half hour of cardio four times a week and strength training the other three days, and stretching and doing all the walking and everything every day. And I’m amazed at even though I’ve reduced the medication. Um, I feel better now, and that’s probably just even since a month ago, you have had so many days in a row where it’s like, I feel Fantastic. And it doesn’t matter what’s going on outside. It could be snowing, it could be raining, it could be whatever. I just every single day, it’s like Groundhog Day, you know, I just, I feel good every single day. And I attribute that to the increase in exercise because the diet is constant. I don’t mess around with that. I don’t take any chances with trying new things. You know, I’ve got my diet and it’s working for me, so where I can play around is with the physical side of things, the exercise, mobility and so on. And especially now that I’ve completely gone off the medication, I think that that’s going to be really important to stay on top of.

Clint – It is a medicine of its own, isn’t it? And I’m glad that, you know, you put in words the philosophies that we hold for everyone, which is exactly that you can only be you. Once you’ve been through the gut restoration process, and then you’re able to eat a lot of diversity in your diet, and you’re eating some nuts and seeds and you’re eating like, big meals with lentils and rice, and even some avocado here and there and some sourdough bread. And you’re able to eat all these different things on top of all the fruits and veggies and everything. Of course, we’ve got limited ways that we can put together these wonderful foods, but there is no limit to the amount of strength and physical expression that we can achieve. And therein lies the missing piece for so many people. And that’s why 60, 70% of all my social media is all around physical therapy, because most people think you change your diet, and that’s the answer. No, it’s a piece of a large puzzle of which have many other pieces. So I want to talk to you about what would be 3 or 4 exercise sort of beliefs that you have, or rules that you have for yourself and your RA, for example. To make this a little clearer, something like, um, as long as I get stronger, I’ll keep the pain away. Or do you have some things like that that you believe are truths for you?

Elaine – The first one, probably, and it’s something that I’m sure everybody has heard motion is lotion. You know, just if you keep moving, your joints are going to feel so much better. And I do notice it if I’m sitting with my work, I can be sitting for hours at a time. And even before the RA, you know, I’d stand up and it’s like, oh, I’ve been sitting for too long and I’ve stiffened up. So it’s not just for us folks with RA, but anybody, you know, you just need to be moving regularly throughout the day. Um, I think variety probably is important for me mentally to keep it interesting. Um, and consistency would be the other thing just to make sure, I mean, it’s, it’s a non-negotiable for me, physical activity, just like the diet and so on, is a non-negotiable. And I think it’s helping with other things like stress, mental health, um, sleep. And those are, you know, those are important aspects as well, particularly for those of us with RA who can be affected. And even `when I started this program early on, I remember us having a discussion because I had Um, been working and I was under a lot of stress, and I wasn’t eating when I should be eating. I probably wasn’t drinking enough, and I felt it the next day. And so you put me back on the right track and said, okay, you need to be consistent in these areas so I stuck with it. But over time, what I’ve realized is that having the solid foundation of diet and exercise has meant that if stress creeps in, it’s not affecting me the way it did a couple of years ago, where boom, the next day I’d really feel it. Now, I don’t, you know, maybe if it was prolonged, I would. But I can handle the stuff that life throws at me. You know, the curveballs here and there, or I don’t sleep well for whatever reason. The next day, it doesn’t hit me the way it did before. So I’ve built up a level of resilience two years into it that I didn’t have in the beginning.

Clint – So insightful. That’s also what has been my experience as well. You know, you get to the point where you can eat out without worrying about a bit of oil. I can get 4 or 5 days without going to the gym. And all that happens to me is I just start to get a little bit like unsettled i just want to go to the gym. It’s just it feels like I’m missing part of my life that’s crucial, the wheels don’t fall off. So, yeah, you get more and more resilient. Exactly. So it’s very exciting where it’s going. What did exercise look like when you first began? And I know you’ve already gone through some of this, but, um, just give us a sort of a quick bullet point of what exercise, for example, on your workout days look like now?

Elaine – When I first started out, I was following what you have in the program. I was was following the upper and lower body program, and then I added stationary bike to it. And so just getting a little bit of cardio 15 minutes on the stationary bike, and I do that a couple of days a week so it was very basic. And I had kind of hit a point where I needed to up my game. And you talked about getting out and joining a gym, and I knew that if I had to go somewhere, it was less likely to happen for me. And, you know, everybody is different and what works for me might not work for someone else. I knew I had to be self-sufficient at home and do it that way. And I started working with Carl. So doing the, uh. Functional movement coaching with him. And we now work together on a weekly basis. And he has guided me through a program that works for me where we can target specific areas that might need strengthening because he can look and say, okay, your shoulder might be weak because your hip is giving you problems or your your neck, you know, whatever it might be, he has the background and training to understand how it all fits together and works with me on a program.

Elaine – So now what I’m doing is, uh, using weights. Uh, I’m pretty much off resistance bands at this point, and I’m doing weight training and other mobility type exercises. I’m doing a lot of balance using, uh, wobble board or, um, that type of thing to make sure that I’ve got good flexibility and, uh, good reactive times, which helps everybody as they age, uh, you know, just exploring other ways to keep it interesting, working with him on that. And so I meet with him once a week, and then I do those routines three times a week. And I keep him informed if I’ve, for example, added the cardio, he looks at the program that I’m doing just to make sure that there isn’t anything that he thinks could be detrimental to me because I have tried some things and it’s like, okay, that’s not going to work, it’s causing me problems. So, you know, we correct that and, and we keep changing. It’s at a point now where I’ve gone from very modest just movement to make sure that everything is working properly, to really pushing myself and continuing to increase the weights and continuing to increase the whatever it might be. Step ups and those types of things, increasing the duration of the cardio and the intensity of it.

Clint – The last 30s I want everyone to just absolutely absorb, skip back 30s listen to it again if you need to. So when you’re on a mission to get to the point that Elaine has gotten to, at some point you have to be implementing more resistance, more reps, and building more strength at a level that you previously felt was unattainable. Now that becomes the norm and you strive for more. And so the research around longevity, people who live the longest, and the connection to physical abilities, both strength and endurance, and VO2 max, and all these ways of measuring cardiovascular fitness and strength are so closely tied that essentially there seems to be no limit. The fitter and stronger you can become the best chance of having the longest, most disease free life you have. And so it’s no secret that it’s going to work for rheumatoid arthritis, it’s no different. It’s just a different expression of the body having a form of ill health. And the ill health is on the inside. It’s harder to detect than high cholesterol, high blood pressure, obesity. These things are much more obvious and easier to measure with rheumatoid things like, you know, dysbiosis of the bowel, leaky gut, nervous system dysregulation, oxidative stress. These aren’t the things that are easily measured in the local quest lab. But they exist on the inside and we need to resolve them, just like we need to resolve issues of more obvious and easier to detect health problems. So if we lean in to that universal wisdom, strength and fitness gives us the best chance of longevity. Symptoms go down accordingly. Internally, everything looks good when you can measure those things through specialist techniques. We feel happier, we’re more resilient. So. It’s a wonderful illustration of what’s possible. Your description of what you’ve done. And I want to know what’s next for you. What are you striving for? Say in the next six months?

Elaine – Oh, well, over the next six months, um, obviously, as my body starts to. As the medication withdraws from my body because it takes several weeks for it to build in your system. So I assume that over the next little while, it’s going to, you know, it’ll take some time for it to be completely gone. So I’m looking forward to the next short term, three months, having another good blood test and no return of symptoms. Um, just continuing with the, um, same levels of activity and everything, but I think and I’ve said this before and didn’t actually do it. I’ve got a bike sitting downstairs that still has never been on the road, so hopefully getting out and biking and doing more hiking and those types of activities, you know, just really getting out and enjoying life and, and. Not thinking about the fact that I have rheumatoid arthritis, but thinking about, you know, what’s the next big adventure in our lives? You know, doing more traveling and venturing a little further afield because that has been something that with travel, I’m always thinking because I’m very careful about what I eat, how am I going to manage this? So I think those are the types of challenges that I’m going to be facing. Um, you know, just figuring out how I can be out in the world and functioning and not setting myself back, because now that I’m medication free, I want to stay medication free. I don’t want to risk a setback. So, you know, the next six months I’m going to be continuing to be careful. But, um, you know, hopefully the symptoms don’t return and I’m able to continue to improve and enjoy life and live it to its fullest.

Clint – It’s difficult to imagine that symptoms would return when you have decreased so, so consistently your medication to such such a low amount, just a the lowest dose of the hydroxychloroquine only twice a week. And three months ago that was put in place. And here we are a week ago and your blood still look great. You’ve increased your ability with your, you know, physical therapy, and you feel even more energized than before with resilience, with foods, resilience with the weather. You’re happiness is at all time high. It’s very difficult. There is no room for symptoms to return in this current paradigm. If I lean into my 20 years of RA experience and 16 years of helping people with this disease. So my money is on you to see this out completely with total success.

Clint – So thanks for coming on the podcast, Elaine. And if someone’s listening or watching this and wants to go on a journey like Elaine did, and meet Karl and work with Karl, our wonderful South African who does our physical therapy and functional movement to work with Cassandra, our dietitian. Doctor Jacob, our wonderful medical doctor and, um, Doctor Price, who does our psychologist, and psychology support work and myself to reach out. And if you’re ready to rock and roll and you’re sick of symptoms and you want to go on a mission, well, we can hold your hand through, uh, a series of step by step processes to get your pain down. There’ll be a somewhere to contact us near this video. So Elaine, thank you so much and I really appreciate your time and I wish you all the best over the coming months. And we’ll be in contact inside the coaching portal supporting you if needed.

Elaine – Thank you. Clint, thank you for everything. It’s been an amazing two years and I really appreciate you. I appreciate the community and thank you for giving me my life back.

Clint – You’re welcome. Doesn’t feel like the right phrase, but basically, congratulations. This is why we do what we do. And I am filled with the joy knowing how far you’ve come and what life can be in the future now. So thank you.

Elaine – Thanks. Appreciate it.